Forum/General Discussion/Circle Hooks in 2 weeks

Circle Hooks in 2 weeks

3,772 views·23 replies·by pequa1··
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#1
Fishing for striped bass using natural baits? Make sure you’re using a non-offset, inline circle hook – it’s now officially a coastwide regulation, with no exception!

On October 21, 2020, the Atlantic Striped Bass Management Board (Board) of the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission (ASMFC) met electronically as part of the 79th Annual Meeting to review the specifications for implementing the new circle hook requirement along the Atlantic coast.

Approved in October 2019, the change to the Atlantic Striped Bass Interstate Fishery Management Plan (FMP) implemented coastwide harvest reductions put in place in 2020, while also requiring the mandatory use of circle hooks when fishing with bait to reduce release mortality in recreational striped bass fisheries. As per the FMP, states are required to implement circle hook requirements by January 1, 2021.

At the October 21 meeting, each state provided its implementation plan complete with any requested exemptions for review and approval. While the proposed regulatory language varied slightly from state to state, at its core the meaning and intent was consistent across all proposals. The only states that submitted exemption requests were Maine, Massachusetts and the Potomac River Fisheries Commission (though the Potomac River Fisheries Commission subsequently withdrew its exemption request and modified its proposal for year-round circle hook requirement).

Maine asked that rubber or latex tube rigs be exempt from the circle hook restriction as long as they conform with the following: the lure must consist of a minimum of 8 inches of latex rubber tubing with a single hook protruding from the end portion of the tubing where bait may be attached. Use of treble hooks is not allowed with these rigs.

Massachusetts sought a circle hook exemption for anglers fishing onboard for-hire vessels; furthermore, Massachusetts asked that the circle hook requirement for shore-bound and private shall not apply to any artificial lure designed to be trolled, cast and retrieved, or vertically jigged with natural bait attached.

Prior to withdrawing their exemption request, the Potomac River Fisheries Commission sought to have the circle requirement not be required prior to May 1 during catch and release season (barbless hooks required).

A motion was made by Tom Fote (NJ) and seconded by Dennis Abbot (NH) to approve the implementation plans but to prohibit any states from gear or user exemptions. A motion to substitute was then made by Megan Ware (ME) to approve the implementation plans and exemptions with the exception of the Massachusetts for-hire exemption; it was seconded by Justin Davis (CT). After lengthy discussion, the motion failed by a count of five in favor (RI, ME, MA, DE, NC), eight opposed (DC, PA, NJ, VA, NH, NY, MD, VA, NC PRFC), one null (CT), and two abstains (USFWS, NMFS).

The original motion was then called and it passed with a vote of 15 in favor (ME, NH, MA, RI, NY, NJ, PA, DE, MD, DC, PRFC, VA, NC, NMFS, USFWS) and one opposed (CT) thereby approving and requiring the use of circle hooks by all recreational anglers when targeting striped bass with any kind of live or dead natural bait effective January 1, 2021. No exemptions were made for gear type or user groups and therefore this regulation includes shore-bound, private boat and anglers onboard for-hire vessels.

With no gear type exemptions allowed, the new circle hook requirement in place for 2021 includes but is not limited to such angling techniques as a tube and worm; eelskin rig; rigged eel; the addition of pork rind, squid, etc. to a bucktail jig; and any and all other scenarios where a natural bait is added to an artificial lure when targeting striped bass.



The FMP defines a ‘circle hook’ as a non-offset hook where the point is pointed perpendicularly back towards the shank. The term ‘non-offset’ means the point and barb are in the same plane as the shank (e.g., when the hook is laying on a flat surface, the entire hook and barb also lay flat).
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
george
georgeADMIN2020#2
Thanks for posting. I have mixed emotions on this one. What's next no light tackle because we're stressing them too much? I'm sure that would save a lot of fish. I'm already hearing whispers of regulating the use of treble hooks.

Once you open that door on striped bass the potential for further regulations is endless.
CommodoreOriginal Crew5,158 postsSince 2018
Snapprhead27
Thanks for posting. I have mixed emotions on this one. What's next no light tackle because we're stressing them too much?
Which further backs what you had stated in the past about the mortality rate of releasing the big ones. Who knows what happens after.
Captain4,988 postsSince 2020
captmike28
captmike28FREE2020#4
Pequa, I need a little more explanation. I understand the need and requirement of using a circle hook when presenting any natural bait, live or dead if targeting Striped Bass.

What I am not clear on is your statement in the paragraph just before the hook illustrations. Are you saying that if I use a bucktail jig with a Fat Cow or Otter Tail strip then the jig must be equipped with a circle hook? I am not even sure if such jigs exist at this time.

This is a major issue for me as we do the majority of our Bass fishing in Plum Gut and the Race using bucktails on the traditional 3 way rigs drifted in these waters. Can you clarify?
CaptainOriginal Crew1,847 postsSince 2018
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#5
Only what i read above. Personally I only rarely fish for bass, usually bellying or chunking when i can use circle hooks until the fall when I exclusively surfcast with unadorned lures. I am getting sick and tired of all the regulations starting with the unSAFE Act. Oddly enough I just started this summer adding pork rinds to my bucktails that lost the tail of a curly Gulp when fluking. For me the operative word would b targeting ( fluke, not bass.)
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
TalkFishTV.com
Just my two cents...this has to be the worse deployment of an attempt to improve the striped bass fishery. Tons of promoting the use of circle hooks but next to zero information on how to use them or what size to use. It's not as simple as just letting them run. The feeding nature, style of fishing, and size of targeted fish must be considered. Not to mention the retraining of anglers. Mark my word, due to the learning curve and lack of proper information, this is going to do more damage than good for a few years. Ever tried removing a circle hook that is not properly placed or deep hooked? Suffering and death are certainties.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
TalkFishTV.com
Pequa, I need a little more explanation. I understand the need and requirement of using a circle hook when presenting any natural bait, live or dead if targeting Striped Bass.

What I am not clear on is your statement in the paragraph just before the hook illustrations. Are you saying that if I use a bucktail jig with a Fat Cow or Otter Tail strip then the jig must be equipped with a circle hook? I am not even sure if such jigs exist at this time.

This is a major issue for me as we do the majority of our Bass fishing in Plum Gut and the Race using bucktails on the traditional 3 way rigs drifted in these waters. Can you clarify?
Keying in on the words artificial or natural bait should help clarify things a bit.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#8
while I hardly ever use bait at all anymore, the couple of schoolies I did catch off the beach a few years ago using small bunker chunks and a 7/0 circle were a circle hook salesman's dream. Securely hooked in a corner of the mouth, easy to remove but those fish were not getting off by themselves. I also hooked some schoolies bellying with 5/0 or 6/0 circles with same results. I really don't think "relearning" how to hook a fish with a circle is all that tough. In fact, putting the rod in a rod holder on the boat or kayak or in a PVC tube on the beach and whale watching is a preferred method. I found it more disconcerting that some survey organization wanted us to weigh, measure AND REMOVE SOME SCALES (!!) before returning the fish to the water. My buddy did it in 2018, no way I would. I likened it to those idiots running halfway up the beach for a camera when they catch a rat after dragging it 20 yards up the sand.
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#9
I believe the keyword is artificial or natural bait.
they seemed to define pork rind as "natural." Seems as though they own stock in Berkley or Fat Cow.
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
TalkFishTV.com
while I hardly ever use bait at all anymore, the couple of schoolies I did catch off the beach a few years ago using small bunker chunks and a 7/0 circle were a circle hook salesman's dream. Securely hooked in a corner of the mouth, easy to remove but those fish were not getting off by themselves. I also hooked some schoolies bellying with 5/0 or 6/0 circles with same results. I really don't think "relearning" how to hook a fish with a circle is all that tough. In fact, putting the rod in a rod holder on the boat or kayak or in a PVC tube on the beach and whale watching is a preferred method. I found it more disconcerting that some survey organization wanted us to weigh, measure AND REMOVE SOME SCALES (!!) before returning the fish to the water. My buddy did it in 2018, no way I would. I likened it to those idiots running halfway up the beach for a camera when they catch a rat after dragging it 20 yards up the sand.
Schoolies are one thing but setting that rod in the holder and hooking into any cows with circle hooks under 20/0 is going to deep hook and kill it. Big fish, big mouths, suck down prey. Seasoned anglers targeting cows with bait have been taught traditionally to use the least amount of drag possible to prevent the bass from feeling line tension and spiting the bait. Too small circle hooks result in 100% deep hooking and it's impossible to remove a deep hooked circle hook without cutting the hook itself and removing the halves.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#11
With a slot limit "seasoned anglers" should not be "targeting" cows anymore anyway, unless its for those "look at me !" photo ops. Setting a tighter drag to allow the circle hook to do its thing is the answer, but while it works on a boat, "whale watching" from the beach will require one hand on the spiked rod LOL. I see a paucity of 3 ounce plugs, Kastmasters and bucktails in the near future. I have never gut hooked a bass with a lure.
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
TalkFishTV.com
With a slot limit "seasoned anglers" should not be "targeting" cows anymore anyway, unless its for those "look at me !" photo ops. Setting a tighter drag to allow the circle hook to do its thing is the answer, but while it works on a boat, "whale watching" from the beach will require one hand on the spiked rod LOL. I see a paucity of 3 ounce plugs, Kastmasters and bucktails in the near future. I have never gut hooked a bass with a lure.
Great points, definitely something to think about. Not so sure we get to choose what size fish takes our bait though. I find 20/0 hooks culls through smaller bass, hooks slot fish perfectly, and cows as well. I do love lures as well and have only used bait during one season out of ten. You do have me considering things though and that's a good thing.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
TalkFishTV.com
With a slot limit "seasoned anglers" should not be "targeting" cows anymore anyway, unless its for those "look at me !" photo ops. Setting a tighter drag to allow the circle hook to do its thing is the answer, but while it works on a boat, "whale watching" from the beach will require one hand on the spiked rod LOL. I see a paucity of 3 ounce plugs, Kastmasters and bucktails in the near future. I have never gut hooked a bass with a lure.
Great points, definitely something to think about. Not so sure we get to choose what size fish takes our bait though. I find 20/0 hooks culls through smaller bass, hooks slot fish perfectly, and cows as well. I do love lures as well and have only used bait during one season out of ten. You do have me considering things though and that's a good thing.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#14
Great points, definitely something to think about. Not so sure we get to choose what size fish takes our bait though. I find 20/0 hooks culls through smaller bass, hooks slot fish perfectly, and cows as well. I do love lures as well and have only used bait during one season out of ten. You do have me considering things though and that's a good thing.
Me too. there is something special about chucking a bait out and sitting back on an inverted spackle bucket, with one hand on the spiked rod. But 20/0 hooks ! Yikes. I think when I made my own gaff for blues 30+ years ago I used a smaller hook !

(It is going to be interesting when other than the two of us chime in lol.)
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
captmike28
Sorry if I am thick headed and missing an obvious point but I still don't think the regulation regarding fishing with bucktails and a trailer is clear. I have read the sentence over repeatedly about adding a "pork rind, squid, rigged eel", or any natural bait to an artificial lure. I am 99% certain that Fat Cow and Otter Tails baits are in fact artificial themselves; I believe they are some sort of reinforced cloth material, but definitely not an animal product like true pork rind and hence not a natural bait. I suspect this issue may come down to a "judgement call" on the part of the DEC officer you encounter in such a situation.

In regard to gut hooking fish, while it is possible for this to happen using many different methods my personal observations based upon 50 years of Striped Bass fishing on the North Fork is that circle hooks will dramatically reduce the numbers of gut hooked fish as compared to standard J style hooks. I tend to use 8/0 or 9/0 Circles on the rare occasion when I bait fish and haver never gut hooked a fish with those, landing fish up to the 40# class this way.

I will also say, although some may disagree, I rarely gut hook Bass when fishing a 3 way rig drifting bucktails. The speed of the drifts when working turbulent waters like Plum Gut or the Race do not give the fish enough time to deeply inhale the lure.
CaptainOriginal Crew1,847 postsSince 2018
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#16
Captmike- I fully agree that one should be fine adding a Fat Cow or Otter Tail to a bucktail while targeting stripers. They are not natural and no different than a Gulp added on the hook. All the pork rind, evidently considered a "natural" bait since pigs can swim (but not fly) I have squirreled away will be used off my kayak in the back bay, replacing the amputated tails of Gulp grubs while fishing for fluke and weaks. (I think I accidentally caught ONE schoolie over ten years doing this.)

With the exception of a fluke when I used spearing and squid over ten years ago, my only gut hooks over the years have been when fishing clams, at anchor, and never with a circle. But as I have said, the vast majority of my bass fishing is with lures from the beach in the fall, and no bait for them for at least five years, with the exception of one or two bellying forays during which if I do so again I will simply switch to circle hooks with an extra little rubber band.
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
captmike28
Thanks for your comments, Pequa. I do believe we are on the same page regarding bucktails and artificial trailers. I just hope the enforcement officers see it the same way.

I also realize that our styles of Bass fishing are very different. As I mentioned in the earlier post I really don't do much bait fishing for Bass from either an anchored or drifting boat. You seem to enjoy the challenge of catching Bass from the beach on artificials, I feel the same way about 3 way bucktailing.

It is not a simple technique to master. Every season I watch customers who are experienced fisherman working hard to master this method. Sure there are the rare days when the fish commit suicide, but most of the time it takes a lot of finesse to consistently score with this method.
CaptainOriginal Crew1,847 postsSince 2018
pequa1
pequa1MOD2020#18
Not counting surfcasting I almost never fish for stripers which is why the circle hook requirement doesn't impact me much at all.
CommodoreOriginal Crew7,027 postsSince 2018
CELLFISH
CELLFISHFREE2020#19
Schoolies are one thing but setting that rod in the holder and hooking into any cows with circle hooks under 20/0 is going to deep hook and kill it. Big fish, big mouths, suck down prey. Seasoned anglers targeting cows with bait have been taught traditionally to use the least amount of drag possible to prevent the bass from feeling line tension and spiting the bait. Too small circle hooks result in 100% deep hooking and it's impossible to remove a deep hooked circle hook without cutting the hook itself and removing the halves.

20/0 hooks and what are cows .?
CommodoreOriginal Crew18,289 postsSince 2019
TalkFishTV.com
With a slot limit "seasoned anglers" should not be "targeting" cows anymore anyway, unless its for those "look at me !" photo ops. Setting a tighter drag to allow the circle hook to do its thing is the answer, but while it works on a boat, "whale watching" from the beach will require one hand on the spiked rod LOL. I see a paucity of 3 ounce plugs, Kastmasters and bucktails in the near future. I have never gut hooked a bass with a lure.
Great points, definitely something to think about. Not so sure we get to choose what size fish takes our bait though. I find 20/0 hooks culls through smaller bass, hooks slot fish perfectly, and cows as well. I do love lures as well and have only used bait during one season out of ten. You do have me considering things though and that's a good thing.
20/0 hooks and what are cows .?
This video shows the difference between a 10/0 and my preferred 20/0 circle hook. Everyone told me to fish 8/0 circles. They thought and still believe I’m nuts about using 20/0 circle hooks but it comes from personal experience and sheer love for our striped bass fishery. There’s no harm in going bigger but definitely a elevated chance of harm going too small. As removing or trying to remove a deep hook most especially a circle hook is absolutely going to cause harm. From my passion for stripers and frustration for a lack of circle hook use intel, I fished every size from 8/0 up to 20/0 in order to identify the right size to consistently safely hook and release stripers. As a result, I lost many nights sleep and still bare the guilt of ignorantly gut hooked stripers. Almost everything under 20/0 was certain to end up swallowed and gut hook due to the way stripers feed. I’m working on a video of multiple sessions that shows all the test. Here’s a video of a properly placed 20/0 circle hook. I’ve caught everything from under slot sized and up through cow (breeding class size) stripers with it. The proper circle hook size is also just one piece of the puzzle. Proper gear, drag setting, when to reel, fight time, time out of water, proper handling, and revival are all important factors. I believe the understanding of breeder class varies. As for me personally any Striper 30” and over I consider breeders. I hope this helps.
DeckhandOriginal Crew16 postsSince 2019
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